From:
"gemma" Date: Fri Jul 6, 2001
2:19 am
Subject: Re: Sub and dom aftercare.
Here are some thoughts to share
with you Lady Sun.
1. What is aftercare?
Yes ..... I agree that it's the things
that are done afterward to ensure loving
closure to a scene. But I also think
it can really vary depending on the relationship,
or even on the stage of the relationship.
I believe that aftercare following casual
play is completely different than aftercare
within a more longterm situation.
In a casual play situation it tends to be
more focused on immediate concerns, whereas
in an ongoing longterm relationship I think
the aftercare itself is also more ongoing
...... spreading into further discussions,
etc. in the hours/days following if necessary.
And no ..... I'm not saying that one is
better than the other .....
just that they are different for the very
reason that different
scenes can be so different. Different
scenes require different aftercare.
2. Does it apply to both dom's and
sub's?
I must admit that this one really made
me think hard, because if I have travelled
(subspaced/flown) far enough during a scene
then I know that I am in no fit state to
offer aftercare to my Dominant. There's
no two ways about that one! ~s~
But perhaps my total dependance on His
care of me afterwards is a way of showing
my love and trust.
3. What actions are performed in
aftercare?
Nurturing actions. Whether it be
warm and tender caresses, a needed drink
of juice, that bar of chocolate to fix the
blood sugars, or the warmth of a cozy blanket
I think they are all nurturing.
4. What is top drop? Is there
a similar thing that occurs to sub's (other
than subspace)?
I must admit I have never spoken personally
to a Top who has shared an experience of
this.
But I think the equivalent for a sub is
a "crash", not subspace. I always
thought that subspace is a matter of degree
as we travel to that special place we get
to .... our happy place. Deepest subspace
is the place to whch we travel when all
is well and the endorphins are flowing freely.
For me a "crash" happens when I am suddenly
pulled from that state in too quick a manner,
and that can happen for a variety of reasons
..... including insufficient aftercare (see
note above *LOL*) or even an unwarranted
distraction in the midst of scene.
It could even be something as simple as
a group of people standing near a piece
of equipment and talking so loudly that
it makes concentration more difficult.
I think a crash could also occur if a flashback
happens, or if something suddenly makes
one uncomfortable with the
action taking place - even if it was previously
negotiated. Although the last mentioned
has not happened to me personally, I have
heard that experience voiced by other submissives
when we have discussed such things.
5. Why does top drop or sub [drop] occur?
Hmmmmm ...... I think I also have to say
"see above" as I believe I answered this
as I woffled on in Question 4! ~grin~
It's interesting to read the different
responses and I hope some of the Dominants
and Dominatrices will also share.
I would just like to mention a sort of
appendix to Question 2
though. I may not always be in a fit
state to render aftercare ....
but I also think that "pre-care" should
be mentioned here. I know that there
are certain actions which help T to centre
himself, and there are ways I can show him
that I value him before we start to play.
I like to think that those little touches
perhaps help prevent "Top drop" because
they show my love and submission.
Hope that all made sense and didn't seem
too long-winded!
gemma
P.S. Please excuse any typos ......
for some reason the "preview" button seems
to be missing from the posting choices tonight!
From: sub beauty
Date: Fri Jul 6, 2001 12:45
am
Subject: Re: Sub and dom aftercare
This thread struck a different cord in
me, perhaps
something others feel??
What is top drop? Is there a similar
thing that occurs to sub's(other than subspace)?
i have experienced something i call subbie
crash and for me it happens a few days after
a scene, usually 3 days.
i refer to it as crashing because it feels
much like coming down from a high or PMS
with attitude, emotions run all over the
place with an overall feeling of depression.
Bouts of crying and/or extreme bitchiness
are not
uncommon.
Why does top drop or sub [drop] occur?
My best guess is that it is a leveling
out of hormones and endorphines but i have
no hard evidence to back that up.
What is aftercare? What actions are
performed in aftercare?
When i crash i find the best after care
is to talk with the Dom whom i scened with,
for me just making the connection with my
scene partner helps. Discussing what i am
feeling and why and knowing it is ok.
Does it apply to both dom's and sub's?
That i do not know for as i said this is
part of my experience but, i have had conversations
that lead me to believe that i am not the
alone and yes, some Dom's and sub's go through
some level of this type of crash.
beauty
From: "Lady
Sun"
Date: Thu Jul 5, 2001 3:36 am
Subject: Re: Sub and dom aftercare.
so, I thought I would share my thought's...
> 1. What is aftercare?
It's doing anything after the scene that
tends to the needs of the
dom/top and sub/bottom and encourages good
feelings!
> 2. Does it apply to both dom's
and sub's?
Yes, although traditionally the focus has
been on the ub/bottom. If the sub/bottom
goes into subspace they might not be able
to
immediately tend to the dominant's/top's
needs, but in time - they can. Such
as calling up the dom/top the day after
to make sure all is well or thanking the
dom/top for sending them to a glorious place
or kissing the hand that has just whipped
them.
> 3. What actions are performed in
aftercare?
Confirming that all is well. Thanking
each other. Offering
water/juice and perhaps a blanket to the
submissive. Hugging and holding.
If the submissive/bottom didn't go into
subspace, offering to go get the dom/top
water or anything else for that matter.
Finding a chair or comfy couch to settle
into after the scene. Spending a few
minutes with each other. Confirming
that everything went well and if it didn't
to let the other know. Calling and
checking in on other each other the next
day and even up to a few days or more after
the scene. Making sure the "impact"
areas on the sub/bottom's body are tended
to. Bringing some chocolate or flowers
to present to the dom/top after the scene.
(that's my own wish.. i'm such an old fashioned
Girl sometimes... hehe). It's all
really a matter of, "to each their own"..
anything that wil make them feel good about
the experience.
> 4. What is top drop? Is there
a similar thing that occurs to
> sub's(other than subspace)?
I believe Top drop is when one feels empty
after a scene. They might feel that
they have put a lot of effort into the scene
and have received no thanks or appreciation.
Also, they might think that they haven't
'performed well' or 'feel badly about their
sadism' and need reassurance that all is
well. I think that sub's can drop
too and it's either due to the endorphin
levels being at "normal" levels or because
they have went somewhere so deep and they
might feel shame or a humbling of spirits.
> 5. Why does top drop or sub [drop] occur?
See above.. hehe.. I wrote my own questions
and I can't even answer them properley...
lmao...
I have posted these questions to various
lists and have found some wonderful feedback,
I might just ask all the authors for permission
to reprint their answers on my website so
that we can get a collection of thought's
and opinions on the subject. It's
my belief that there is no one-true-way
but there are common elements. Also
everyone presents things a little differently
and I know that sometimes I leave stuff
out that seem "obvious" to me but might
not be "obvious" to other's.
Warm regards,
Lady Sun.
If you have thought's
to share on "aftercare", please forward
your responses to ls@ladysun.info.
|
From:
"Kerosene (m) & Candles (f)"
Date: Wed Jun 27, 2001 11:08 pm
Subject: Re: [DSSG-Toronto] Sub and
dom aftercare.
This topic of conversation is absolutly
perfect as we just recently learned about
aftercare..(thank goodness for the guidance
of a knowledgeable DSSG Domme [Mairsi] !)
Let's see how much I can remember from the
"lessons"..*S*
Hmmmm
where are those notes I took...? *L*
1. What is aftercare?
allowing the individual to just feel the
sensations after a
scene...relaxing, drifting... allowing time
to enjoy and come out of headspace
safely ... a warm safe place...
2. Does it apply to both dom's and
sub's?
Yes.. both can experience headspace and
both need a form of aftercare.. although
in our experience the "rush" experienced
by the sub can be stronger and require more
aftercare than that of the Domme/Dom.
3. What actions are performed in
aftercare?
Fluids, fluids, fluids; blanket wrap, stroking....
the word "care" says it all...
4. What is top drop? Is there
a similar thing that occurs to sub's(other
than subspace)?
From what I have learned, it is similar
to sub drop and often occurs the next day
after a scene. It can take different forms
for different people. Feelings of
depression, mood changes... feeling like
something is missing.. longing for
your P/playpartner..or can be similar to
a hangover (I have a
friend who experiences this)
5. Why does top drop or sub [drop] occur?
The endorphins and mental state produced
can be like a drug..and when a drug is gone..
the withdrawal symptoms set in..
I have been told that this reaction is
similar to post natal depression resulting
from the disappearance after childbirth
of the endorphins which build up in a women
during pregnancy, a similar situation is
true for the absence of the endorphins after
a scening session.
As individuals who are new to BDSM, these
were very important topics for us to learn
about.. especially to ensure safety and
the continued enjoyment of scening....
Looking forward to reading other views
on this topic..
Candles
From: jean@c...
Date: Wed Jun 27, 2001 6:01
pm
Subject: Re: Sub and dom aftercare.
Lady Sun: Here is a great article on aftercare
from our website:
http://www.voyeurdungeonlive.com. If you
have anyother questions concerning some
topics in the BDSM lifestyle, please check
out our FAQ's.This should help bring up
some good conversation!
Jean
DSSG Tampa
The importance of aftercare in a scene
When we think of "how to's", it is generally
the technical details
that come to mind. A discussion in a chat
room changed my mind in a hurry! A number
of the subs were talking about aftercare.if
it is important.how the lack of aftercare
can turn a good scene.and various other
opinions on the subject.
It is not only the novice Dom or Top who
needs to pay attention to
aftercare, but anyone who is playing. Responsibility
doesn't end when a scene stops, but includes
taking care of the physical and emotional
needs of the sub/bottom as they return from
"sub space".
It is a good idea to have a robe or blanket
handy to wrap the
sub/bottom in after the scene. After an
intense scene, the sub needs time to "come
back to earth" and needs to feel cared for.
As they are frequently not wearing much,
having a robe or blanket to wrap them in
while they sip fruit juice or water (and
of course are cuddles by their Dom) helps
to keep their bodies from going into shock.
The majority of subs are in no condition
to gather the toys and repack the toy bag
directly after the scene. If they are deep
in "sub space" they will frequently need
to feel the presence of their Dom. Many
the time I've had a blanket wrapped sub
sitting at my feet as I've repacked the
toy bag after a heavy scene!
While the above is true of a heavy SM scene,
one must never discount the need for aftercare
in a sensual or sexual D/s or B/d type scene.
While it may not appear to be as emotionally
draining or endorphin producing, I have
found that almost all D/s, B/d or S/m scenes
have the need for aftercare in common. As
your sub's body trembles, be it from pain,
pleasure or sensual stimuli, he/she is experiencing
"sub space". The process of going to a place
that is pure feeling; emotional, physical
and environmental. It isn't rare for a sub
to be totally disoriented after even a "light
scene".
Frequently a sub will feel an intense need
to be close to his/her
Dom. They will sometimes appear to be very
clingy.This is totally normal and natural.
It is one of the wonderful things that happen
in
a great scene! The connection felt during
the scene is so deep that when reality starts
to intrude, a mental and sometimes physical
reaction occurs.
I personally find that most subs and Doms
need to eat after a scene. and are usually
very thirsty even it is only a light or
sensual
scene. Sometimes they don't realize they
need the fluids and or food. A heavy scene
uses a lot of energy.both for the sub/bottom
and the Dom/Top. It has become a practice
with myself to have, at the very least,
a late breakfast with the bottom and to
chat over coffee for a few hours after play.
In all cases, it is preferable to ensure
that the sub/bottom does not return home
to be alone unless they are totally physically
and mentally capable. This practice provides
us, the Tops, with the "aftercare" we need!
YES.Doms/Tops need aftercare too!
From: "Virago
.
Date: Wed Jun 27, 2001 10:05
pm
Subject: Sub and dom aftercare
Questions From: "Lady Sun"
Responses From: "virago"
1. What is aftercare?
IMHO aftercare consists of whatever action
is necessary following a scene to ensure
the safe physical and mental return of the
individuals involved in the scene.
2. Does it apply to both dom's and
sub's?
Yes, absolutely.
3. What actions are performed in
aftercare?
Again IMHO it would depend upon the scene.
A heavy scene or one that involved edge
play may require different aftercare than
a lighthearted fun type of scene.
For instance, if the scene pushed boundaries
for either the sub or Domme and was psychologically
intense perhaps aftercare would take the
form of cuddling, talking lots about what
happened in the scene, how each other felt
about various things and this may occur
over several days.
If the scene produced any kind of physical
trauma such as open wounds (cutting), bruising,
burns, etc. then in addition to talking
some 'first aid' aftercare would be in order.
A light-hearted fun type of scene may require
nothing more than a big hug and a thank
you after the scene. I don't think
that there is any one standard or set way
to approach aftercare -- the scene and players
should dictate what is required.
4. What is top drop? Is there
a similar thing that occurs to
sub's(other than subspace)?
Hmmmm I'm not 100% sure but, I think this
maybe refers to a feeling of emptiness and
nothing left to give or a feeling of not
getting anything in return. The person
is left without any desire to 'play'. Sure,
I think this could apply to either a sub
or Domme but more often it is associated
with Tops since they are controling the
environment.
5. Why does top drop or sub [drop] occur?
I'll take a guess; it occurs when or because
a Top/sub has given the scene their everything
and perhaps they feel like that effort hasn't
been recognized or appreciated.
No doubt if I'm wrong about any of the
above someone will kindly speak up and share
their thoughts.
LS wrote - I have my own *current* thought's
on this and wish to share them if the discussion
gets going.
I for one look forward to hearing them.
virago
From: Janet Hardy
(janetwhardy@mindspring.com)
Subject: Re: Sub(bottom) & dom(top)
aftercare...
Newsgroups: soc.subculture.bondage-bdsm.femdom
Date: 2001-06-27 11:11:14 PST
Home sick today, with time to answer the
good questions...
Lady Sun wrote:
> 1. What is aftercare?
It's whatever the parties involved need
to do after a scene to feel OK about each
other and to help ensure a safe reentry
into the "real world."
> 2. Does it apply to both dom's
and sub's?
Absolutely.
> 3. What actions are performed in
aftercare?
Depends on the individuals. The most common
ones are physical stuff (water to drink,
something to eat, protection against the
chilliness/shiveriness that often strikes
after a heavy scene) and emotional stuff
(cuddling, dozing, verbal reassurances).
I've talked to at least a couple of folks,
though, for whom ideal aftercare is being
tossed harshly into a dank corner and left
alone. Doesn't work for me, but it takes
all kinds.
> 4. What is top drop? Is there
a similar thing that occurs to > sub's(other
than subspace)?
5. Why does top drop or sub [drop] occur?
Top drop and bottom drop (which does, IME,
exist) are partly just letdown after a peak
experience -- you've been someplace really
wonderful and extraordinary, and it's a
big bummer to not be able to be there any
more. But at a deeper level, I think they're
also a lifetime of conditioning about being
"nice" (or, in a bottom's case, "strong
and independent") coming back to bite you
in the ass. Consciously, you know you've
been playing consensually with someone who
welcomes your attentions... subconsciously,
all you know is that you've been really
mean (or, for bottoms, really vulnerable
and dependent), and that subconscious guilt
can lead to feelings of sadness, depression,
even anger -- fights picked in the wake
of a successful scene are a common phenomenon
for many BDSMers.
Verdant
http://www.greenerypress.com
|
